Episode Notes
Get ready for the second part of our inspiring conversation with the multi-talented Joan Baker! In this episode, we delve deeper into her career, exploring her experiences as a voice actor, on-camera host, producer, and educator.
Joan shares valuable insights on the importance of self-discovery and discipline in achieving excellence. She also opens up about her philanthropic endeavors and her commitment to empowering aspiring voice actors through education and mentorship.
Tune in as Joan reveals the secrets behind her success, her passion for giving back, and her unwavering belief in the power of the human voice.
Highlights:
- Joan’s experiences as a voice actor, on-camera host, and producer
- The creation of SOVAS and its impact on the voice acting community
- Insights on the importance of self-discovery, discipline, and mentorship
- Joan’s philanthropic work and commitment to empowering others
- The power of the human voice and its ability to connect and inspire
Don’t miss Part 2 of this captivating interview, and get ready to be inspired by Joan Baker’s incredible journey!
Dive into inspiring stories from leading experts in voice over and learn the key elements to building a successful career in this fascinating industry with Joan’s Baker’s book:
“Secrets of Voice-Over Success: Top Voice-Over Actors Reveal How They Did It”. Find it here: https://a.co/d/cglnsSy
You can email Joan Baker for private coaching at joan@sovas.org using “La Pizarra” or Nicky Mondellini as a reference on the subject.
Also find her on instagram as @joanthevoice
Transcript
Joan Baker: Scene study is to me the best or the first thing in acting I would study.
Nicky Mondellini: Next would be improv, for example?
Joan: I think improv is very important.
Speaker 1: La Pizarra the slate Exploring creative minds in the entertainment industry Here’s your host Nicky Mondellini.
Nicky: Welcome to another episode of La Pizarra. My name is Nicky Mondellini and I’m very happy that you’re joining us today because we have part two of the interview with the amazing Joan Baker. Enjoy.
Joan: Voiceover all the jobs I was getting I was also studying acting. When I was in this acting class and it was advanced class, there were a lot of actors that were actors doing TV and film. At the beginning of class when the teacher would say, “What jobs have people booked?” Very few people and actors were raising their hand saying, “Oh, I booked this or booked that.”
When you book a job as an actor, you might not have another job for six months. You may have that job for 13 weeks but then you might not work for six months. In voiceover, things are very quick turnaround. I was constantly raising my hand and then I was talking big brand jobs. The school hired me to teach.
Nicky: Wow.
Joan: Again, it was an acting school. They hired me to teach and then I took their roller decks and I got students. Also, some of the people my class took as well because they felt like, “Wow. She’s so successful.”At the same time, voiceover you can say a couple of brands, and people are like, “Oh my God. She’s a hit.” Or, “He’s a hit out there.” Anyway, that’s when I started teaching and that was in 1993.
I’ve been teaching for decades now, but that’s when I honed in my platform to teach and I also really loved it. One of the things I discovered in teaching was that I thought not only is this a second career although it’s under the same umbrella. Not only did I think it was a second career, but because the wildest things happen to you in New York when you’re auditioning and you’re not auditioning from home. There was never any home thing. It was all live until the pandemic for New York.
You end up learning and gathering a lot of things that maybe most people might not get when they’re at home and they’re only in their own head. I’m constantly getting feedback from producers and casting directors. I’m in the waiting room and I’m gathering information from just talking with my fellow voice actors. I learned a lot so I was able to share things right away and I knew that I wanted to be doing this too. What I did was, and I don’t know anyone else that was doing this at this time. I remember I would audition let’s just say.
I auditioned for David Letterman in 1993. As it turned out, it was between me and the girl that got the promos because he wanted a woman. The producer told me that. While I’m talking to him, I said “Will you come to my class and talk about the process?” I would have guest speakers that were producers or people that I wanted to network with. Not only was it a learning experience for the class on the highest level, but it was also a way for me to share my experiences and to network. It created such a hubbub.
Agents were speaking in my class that had never done it before. Casting directors were like, “Really?” It really created something special and I don’t know anyone else that was doing that. Again, it came out of what I would like and appreciate in a class. Of course, we worked on technique and performance, which I was getting all the time so it was always first-hand experiences and also the highest level of people in the industry because when you’re at a top agency, that’s what you’re dealing with. I realized I couldn’t live without it.
Nicky: It’s so interesting to hear you say how you started teaching because of your expertise but then you started to really develop it and like it and like to teach. Can you say who was maybe one or two of your teachers or mentors that really created or left a very big imprint in you that also inspired you to continue doing other things and everything that you do with your own technique in teaching?
Joan: You mean in voiceover or in general?
Nicky: I would say in general because it all ties into the entertainment industry but you can say one in general and maybe also someone in voiceover.
Joan: In general, when I studied dance, again, I had extraordinary women teachers. I had men teachers, but I ended up having extraordinary women teachers. One of them was Ann Reinking. She passed away a couple years ago now, but Ann Reinking was the hottest dancer on Broadway. She was Bob Fosse’s girlfriend. All that jazz was all about their relationship and all but she was an extraordinary teacher of mine. I studied with a lot of legends. If it was in African dance, then I studied with extraordinary African teachers. They happened to be women.
Jazz was my thing and everything I studied I poured into jazz. It created a uniqueness. Ann Reinking, there was another teacher named Betsy Howe. I had first heard about her– I don’t know if you remember the movie Flash Dance.
Nicky: Yes
Joan: It was such a big deal in the dance world but Betsy [unintelligible 00:06:20] I had heard of her because she was the original choreographer for the movie and she choreographed that movie without any music. It was really on the low end so she decided that she was going to leave. She left her choreography with the guy that ended up doing it with which was Jeffrey Hornaday. I had heard about her through behind-the-scenes in dance. I knew I wanted to study from her and I did.
In terms of voice acting, this is interesting. My first teacher was Joni Robbins. She is also passed away but she was someone that was more in the cartoon world and genius. Absolute genius and she was also a genius teacher. We became friends after my four sessions with her. She was the one I had four sessions with but for some reason, I worked really hard at it in those four sessions and I already had a natural ability to do things. I also paid my dues in other acting areas. It came together rather quickly and I can’t say that it’s happened to me all the time in my life. It has not.
I really loved that aspect. Joni Robbins I would say in voice acting. Believe it or not, I have not studied with a lot of teachers and voice acting as much as I was getting on-the-job training. I also taught for eight years or many years with Pat Fraley and we taught all kinds of things together. Then the pandemic hit and that stopped. He is an inspiration to me. His skills, his mind, his creativity, his spontaneity is something that truly has inspired me. I have tended in voice acting to use my intense experience being on the job because when I started there weren’t any teachers.
I think there was Joni and then there was another teacher that I heard of. Other than that, there really were no teachers and there certainly weren’t any teachers teaching at acting schools voice acting, and stuff. It just came from me.
Nicky: You also started in 2022 teaching and you’re pioneering at the Hartford.
Joan: University of Hartford, The Hartt School.
Nicky: You are pioneering the voiceover. I don’t know if it’s a program or a major or a class.
Joan: Actually, it is a program but this year I’m working with the school again to expand the program. For me personally, I will be teaching now twice a day on Tuesdays and Thursdays. I will be teaching voice acting twice a day, but I also plan on bringing in more guest speakers that can cover more in-depth around genres that I feel are important in today’s voice-acting world. I also teach the business. That just goes hand in hand.
I will also provide people that focus on the business, but probably on the industry side because we as voice actors really have to learn the language and the flow of people that hire us. I think that’s so important to hear from the people that hire us or hear from the people that facilitate because there’s always been a confusion there. People tend to be scared or nervous even being in the same room with them and they don’t know how to behave, and they certainly don’t know how to thrive. I feel like if I can break the ice, that’s going to help people to thrive.
Also, it’s going to help them to be able to have conversations with everybody in the business, not just their fellow voice actor, or not just an agent, but everybody. That’s one way to get work. Is to have conversations with everybody. Also, miracles happen in conversation. That’s how things happen. It’s important to be able to talk to everyone in the industry and have something to say to them, and listening to them and understand what they’re saying so that you can use that in your entrepreneurial business.
Nicky: What have you seen now with voiceover techniques or actually what is used, like the tendencies I would say probably that are being used now that have actually changed from, I don’t know. When you first started or maybe even 10 years ago.
Joan: Actually, I was doing these things when I first started, and it’s what I still implement today. That is that you have to use your whole body as an instrument in front of the microphone. It is not from the neck up. You have to incorporate everything. I’ve studied speech and diction. Yes, I had a little regionalism as most people do, but it really was more to discover my instrument from that aspect. It’s like learning Greek, or it’s like learning Italian when you study voice, from the speech and diction aspect. I had the best teacher, another inspiration of mine. Her name is Denise Woods.
What you learn from speech and diction, you can absolutely pour into voice acting and upgrade your performance and also your level of knowledge about what you’re doing. Taking a couple classes and then getting the microphone set up, you can’t even talk to people when you don’t know your instrument or you don’t know the craft and how the craft works through you.
I would think if you really want to do this, that you would be led to these things. You wouldn’t have to be convinced of doing it. That to me is the true performer. That they don’t have to be told. They might have to be told where to go, but I’m saying you don’t have to convince them to do it or that it’s a good thing to get coaching. Everyone on this planet gets coached when they’re in an art form or in a sport. That is not unusual.
One of the people that I coached that I ended up loving and partly because he loved education. Everything I said, he took to heart. There was never any skepticism or whatever. That was with the late Johnnie Cochran. I was his coach for three years when I was the voice of Court TV and he had a show on there. Court TV felt like he needed coaching because even though he was great in a courtroom, that doesn’t necessarily translate to television.
It was right after OJ trial. I believe the man was guilty as charged and I felt like I did not want to work with Johnnie Cochran. I thought about it and I said, “I’m not going to let my opinions get in the way of working with someone that I don’t particularly care for.” I ended up turning that train around and that was because of Johnnie. He was one of the most extraordinary students I’ve ever worked with and not because he was Johnnie Cochran, but because of his belief in education, because of his desire to learn and to take it with him.
I remember when I first started working with him, Court TV people, the cameraman, and the director of the show, because he did his own show, they called me up to tell me he was a different person after the days he worked with me on set. A different person.
Nicky: That’s a huge compliment.
Joan: I ended up working with him for three years. I also worked with other anchors like Nancy Grace and I worked with other anchors that weren’t such a high profile name on the air, but it was one of the best experiences. Coaching people that they’re not skeptical. You don’t have to make them do something, but they get it and they want to make their performances and their communication even sharper. It really is inspirational when you work with people like that, as opposed to, “I’ve always been told I have a great voice. How do I get into voiceover? All I need–“
No. You want to break into this industry amazing. That’s how you work, especially in this day and age. Otherwise, why not hire AI? This is something you want to jump through hoops over. As I say to people, to be the performer that you want to be, that I want to be, you have to become unrecognizable to who you know yourself to be in order to be a performer of excellence, a performer that has impact, and a performer that thrives.
Nicky: A transformation is needed definitely because–
Joan: Many. [laughs]
Nicky: You’re going to bring communication to another level and you have to back that up with training, with passion, and you have to put your whole body, your whole soul into it.
Joan: You have to learn how to tap into yourself at will.
Nicky: That’s easy. Not everybody does that.
Joan: No, it’s not, because we’re human too. You have to be able to do that and you can learn because the mechanism is already there. The greats that I would be learning from in dance, that’s what made them great and distinguished them from other dancers. That they were able to tap into something inside and bring that forth. That’s the stuff that heals. It’s not just the stuff that brings you an income, although there’s that too, but it’s the stuff that heals.
Nicky: For sure.
Joan: It’s the stuff that people are clapping about. It’s the stuff that people buy tickets to. It’s the stuff that gets people to buy products in commercials, audiobooks, being able to tap into something other than, “Yes, how do I do this?” By hook or crook, you’re getting insights from Facebook groups and you’re getting 2000 different opinions. That’s just not it.
Nicky: What is now your best advice for someone who wants to start their journey as a voiceover artist? That they know they have a passion for it, but they want to do it the right way. What is the best advice that you could give someone like that?
Joan: I think that’s not a totally easy question because actually, I get that question from all kinds of people all the time. If I don’t know them a little bit even, it’s really hard to give general advice. What I would say generally is I would work on myself first. I would work on my being-ness. For example, I would work on the areas in life that I have said no to and turn them into yeses. Why? Because later on when you do voiceover, when you have to be uninhibited in front of people that you don’t know and that could actually do something for your career, you have to show up uninhibited.
When you’re learning voice acting and you have a lot of issues, even if you don’t even know you do, but you have to work on certain things about yourself first, then I would go into acting class immediately. Some people already have that. If you have that, I would then basically choose a coach that can not just coach you on craft, on skillsets, but also in the industry. Because it’s one-on-one, it’s very different than taking a class. Everything is based on the class curve, where when it’s one-on-one, you can directly work with what people bring to the table naturally, but what they also need to work on.
You can work on that much easier one-on-one. Also, I think people automatically think, “Oh, I talk in real life, I can do that.” You have to bring a script to life. Jobs are actually based on your analysis of the script and then how you bring it to life. It is not based on your voice because we all know at an audition, we all are going to sound the same. It’s done by voice type. At that point, who gets the job? The one that breathes life into the script from their being.
You want to be able to, one, study acting because that’s one place you’re going to be able to tap into yourself. It’s not in vain, because you’re going to bring those acting skills to voice acting. Also, to be honest with you, what I would also do is, some people, they’ve been told they have a great voice, but when you’re talking to them and you’re in the industry, it’s no great shakes. As a matter of fact, even when you have a voice of God, you already know agents have plenty of voices of God on their roster. In a sense, it’s no great shakes, but it’s your responsibility to sharpen your vocal skills, right?
One of the best ways to do it is by singing. Not that you have to be a singer, but to develop the skills of a singer again, that deepens your instrument in terms of bringing the diaphragmatic breath, and tapping into which you can do when you are coming from the diaphragm. You tap into your solar plexus, which sits right behind the diaphragm. That’s where your emotional spontaneity lives. When you’re able to really work with your breath, and that you will definitely do in singing. There’s also other things you can do too but singing, you will definitely work with your breath.
Nicky: I think singing makes you to stretch your voice and notes in many different ways. I do that every morning to warm up my voice before sessions. I don’t feel right, I don’t feel my voice is in a good place unless I do that warm-up that consists of also singing. I think that if everybody could actually tap into that and continue that, what is a type of singing specifically maybe a style or something-
Joan: Oh, I’ll tell you.
Nicky: -that you would recommend.
Joan: Opera. Not pop, necessarily. Not like that. Opera. Opera singers have to tap into their instruments. They have to breathe in a particular way. They have to hold notes. They have to bring color, nuances. They have to bring that through the voice. What do us voice actors have to do? Bring subtlety and nuance to what we’re doing.
Nicky: Totally.
Joan: It’s the equivalent. Opera would be what I would do. By the way, you’re not doing opera to be an opera singer. I studied opera. Trust me, you would not pay to see me sing opera. What I actually focused on with the teacher were scales. I was studying for my voice to expand it, to deepen it, and also to let emotionality shimmer through it. That’s what opera does. The exercises I did weren’t just like, la, la, la, la la, la, la. It wasn’t like that. There was substance and things I’d never heard of that I was practicing and bringing to my voice that totally makes you stand out without trying to stand out.
Nicky: With the scales and everything, it’s a different part of your voice that sometimes you even surprise yourself that you can go there and [crostalk] about it.
Joan: I agree. Also, I happen to be someone, although I would not call myself a singer, although I have sung in my life, but I would not refer to myself as a singer. I don’t have a break in my voice. I could go very, very low on the scale, go very, very low, go to really, really high, past high C without a break. That was the one thing I had.
Nicky: That’s amazing.
Joan: But I’m not a singer. If that had been my ambition, yes, that would be huge. I always wanted to be an [unintelligible 00:23:23] dancer and singing was somehow in the middle. Yes. opera, singing.
Nicky: Definitely.
Joan: Acting, and in particular acting scene study class. This is why, because you’re not just doing monologues, you’re actually working with another person in situations where you’re talking in dialogue, not in monologue. What do we have to do in voice acting? Is to take the script and turn it into dialogue even though we never hear the other person. Now, of course, there’s scripts that have dialogue, but most of the scripts, especially in commercials and all, they’re just one person. We have to create dialogue as if we’re talking to someone. If my husband Rudy happened to walk by, as I’m talking to you right now, he would happen to overhear my point of view of the conversation, although, i.e. I’m in a conversation. That’s what we have to do as voice actors. Scene study is to me the best or the first thing in acting I would study.
Nicky: Next, would we improv, for example?
Joan: I think improv is very important. Remember earlier I said you want to be someone that you want to look at the different areas in your life that you’re saying no to. Obviously, if it’s something harmful, keep saying no, but I’m saying you want to look at areas in your life where you’re saying no and say yes, trust me, that’s improv. That’s the beginnings of improv. I love improv. I think it’s absolutely important to any art form, even dance.
In dance, there’s an art form maybe some might call it improv, but you learn these things in the arts. It’s a given. Yes, improv is very important. When I work with people, when I coach them one-on-one, I will have them say yes to things they normally say no to, because they definitely grow and transform and they actually end up really loving the thing they’ve been saying no to for years. That doesn’t happen right away because I don’t know the person well enough yet to say, “Oh, say yes to this,” but I have done it and it has been transformative.
It has opened up something inside and that’s what’s so important. Because when you’re a kid, if you really study kids, they’re constantly opening up something inside them and it gives them a reason to move. It gives them a reason to explore and to be curious. What is that? Improv. You don’t even have to spend money, even though improv is very cheap, but I’m saying, yes, definitely take improv. What I’m saying is you can start with your own life.
If we were self-loving in every area of our life, our dreams would come true really quick. When you have blocks and areas, it shows up somehow in your career as halfway there or there’s a lot of issues or you get stuck on one thing and you can’t get past it. Say yes to something in your life that you’ve been saying no to. You will see these things change and you may not even connect it to that, but it’s that. Because if we were self-loving in every area of our life, our dreams would be fulfilled immediately.
Nicky: They do, because we would finally give ourselves a chance to explore something that for some reason we thought we couldn’t do it or we shouldn’t do it. [crosstalk] to other–
Joan: There was a huge fear about it.
Nicky: Fear is a big thing that keeps us from doing those things that can be transformative.
Joan: I have done on myself a lot of using myself as a guinea pig. For example, if someone said to me, “Oh, you’re just afraid.” I don’t want it to stop there because that doesn’t create the breakthrough. What am I afraid of? What inside me creates that fear? Maybe it’s about rejection. I’m afraid, but then I go one step past it and it’s because I feel I will get rejected. Then how I respond might be to reject myself first. All that creates fear. This game creates fear.
I think it’s really important and it’s baby steps. You don’t have to jump off the mountain but I’m saying there are areas in our life that are right here in front of us right under our noses that we say no to that we can say yes to and create a breakthrough for ourselves. Oh, and it will show up.
Nicky: What is the thing that you like most about teaching?
Joan: I love connecting people to their truth through their voice and I use commercial acting to do that. I also use other genres, but in particular, I use commercial acting because that is the only area you can get an agent if you’re a newcomer, i.e. you’re not making any money. I also think even when you’re in an agency, most people find that a mystery, commercials. They find the reads a mystery. They find connecting to it a mystery. This isn’t Shakespeare, but it actually is Shakespeare. It just may be 30 seconds worth of Shakespeare, but it actually is Shakespeare.
I also think it’s the basis to a lot of genres because the same language that’s being used in commercial acting, you’re going to hear it in animation. You’re going to hear it in video games. You’re going to hear it in narrating. It’s the same communication. Also, I don’t care what the genre is, people want conversational. You really get to focus on it in commercials. It is to me, the universal language. I love connecting people to their truth through their voice. To me, the voice is the eye of our soul.
It really mirrors your soul, your voice. There’s a lot of miracles that happen when you connect to yourself in that way. When you connect to your truth– They’ll say, fake it till you make it. No. Connect with your truth. You won’t have to fake it. You’ll probably get further faster. Connect with your truth. That’s what you share. Then you don’t have to fake anything.
Nicky: What do you say about, you mentioned AI a little while ago. It’s the dreaded conversation because we’re all like, “Is AI going to take over our voices?” We’re working so hard with training, with everything, with being so truthful, and then all of a sudden the AI models are being perfected where they can really come very close to mimicking all the nuances in the human voice. What is your take on that?
Joan: I truly feel yes, I think we will have to fight. We do other things. So many other things have come along where it was a obstacle. This is definitely a big one, and we’ll definitely have to fight. I think ultimately AI is going to find its place, and it’s not going to necessarily be in voice acting. I also think, that some of the dangers, like I recently heard that an AI from the Trump campaign had sent out phone messages saying in Biden’s voice not to vote. When it gets into politics, they’re going to do something. In particular, through the voice, they’re going to do something.
I think, especially from the people I work with and talk to, they’re not interested in AI. They want humanity to show up in their products. They want humanity to get people to watch the Super Bowl. They want it unless it’s a specialty thing. Now, I’ve also talked to people that are in the e-learning genres where right now people tend to lose their jobs to AI. In that area too, I think people are going to finally go, “You know what, I really do want a human.” You’re not saving all this money with AI when it sounds cheap. When people are using AI, they tend to also get the voice actor because they didn’t like it.
We don’t know how it’s going to end. All we can do is keep focusing on ourselves and what we bring to the table and trust that Ken Burns is not going to hire an AI to do his narrations because he’s not. People that I work with, I don’t know anyone that has said, “Joan, we were thinking about going AI. I’m talking about an advertising agency. We’re thinking about doing our [unintelligible 00:32:21].” I’ve never heard anyone say that yet. I feel like it’s the lower rung that are looking for cheap ways to get things done. They never had any interest in the voice actor. They didn’t even know how to direct them. They really didn’t know anything about them.
There’s plenty of people in the middle like that where they weren’t trained to direct voice talent. They don’t know anything about it. They don’t even want to go through agents, nothing. In a sense, they’re just behaving how they always have but now we’ve coined it. Now something we can coin and point to, AI. They weren’t interested in you in the first place. I see people talk all the time about training clients how to treat them. I have never had to train a client how to treat me. They want their stuff to resonate with audiences. They want to work with the voiceover talent. They want to pay the voiceover talent.
Now, maybe some of them resent how much, I don’t know. What I’m saying is, I’ve never had to train someone to work with me. I don’t really get that. Unless it’s like, again, these other levels that they weren’t interested in voiceover in the first place or voice talent, Producer wants to have the best product out there. If that’s the case, they’re not going to hire AI.
Nicky: It’s more I think for tasks and things that help you organize yourself and your business but actually, when you really want to make a statement or really want to connect with people and have people remember the spots or the movies or the documentaries and really have an impact.
Joan: You’re going to hire a human being. Also, I think AI does have a place. I just don’t think it has a place with show business or performance. I think it has a place in science. Come up with a cure for Alzheimer’s, please, AI. Please, I’m begging you. That’s to me, a great place that will assist the scientists, the doctors. Not take their place. Certainly not take our place.
Nicky: No, definitely. As an assistant, yes, that would be good.
[laughter]
Joan, I have one last question. I don’t mean to monopolize your time. You’ve been very generous with your time. Thank you so much.
Joan: Thank you.
Nicky: If there is something that you would have done if you wouldn’t have gone into the entertainment business and not be a multifaceted artist that you are, what would it have been? Have you toyed with the idea of, “Oh, maybe I would have been–“I don’t know.
Joan: I actually have toyed with it.
Nicky: Oh, yes?
Joan: I think I would have been a metaphysical counselor. A counselor that uses metaphysics and other healing arts to help people. That took me years to come up with because I honestly could not think I would do anything else or wanted to do anything else. Because I studied a lot of metaphysics and because I’ve done a lot of different healing, especially from the past, I’ve met the most extraordinary teachers and healers. I tend to not do anything half-baked. When I’m working on myself, when I’ve been healing my own inner life, I’ve sought out great teachers or great spirits out here so I’ve learned a lot.
I actually apply that to performance to a certain degree, but not necessarily coining it like, “I learned this technique.” No. It depends on the person and where they’re at. It’s all to tap into authenticity. It’s all to tap into what’s really there. Wound or no wound, what’s really there that can be used at this moment that can create something extraordinary?
Nicky: I think that’s beautiful. It definitely complements a lot of what you do. It talks a lot about you, your soul. You’re a giving soul, and you want to help first and foremost. You like to guide people, inspire them, and help them. That really ties in very, very beautifully. Joan, thank you so much for your time.
Joan: Thank you, Nicky. Oh, thank you. I think you’re extraordinary, Nicky.
Nicky: Oh, thank you.
Joan: I think you’re absolutely extraordinary. Talk about a big heart and a giver. Thank you.
Nicky: Thank you, Joan. Definitely, I’m going to put the links in the show notes to your book. People are going to ask me if you do any private coaching.
Joan: I do.
Nicky: You do? When do you find the time for that? You’re a professor. You teach everywhere. Wow. [crosstalk]
Joan: I know. It’s insane. I actually stopped coaching around the end of September. Then I start up again in January when everything is said and done. Right now, I started up again. They can email me at joan@sovas.org. They can also use the podcast name or your name as a reference on the subject.
Nicky: Oh, okay. Perfect. I will definitely put all of that in the show notes.
Joan: Thank you, Nicky. Thank you so much. It was great seeing you. Thank you for pursuing me.
Nicky: Oh, absolutely. Are you kidding me? This is going to be one of my favorite episodes for sure.
Joan: Thank you, sweetie. Have a good night.
Nicky: Thanks. You too. We’ll stay in touch.
Joan: Great. Bye-bye.
Nicky: Bye.
[music]
Speaker 1: Thanks for joining us. Don’t forget to subscribe on your podcast player or YouTube if you haven’t done so. Share what you liked about this episode on social media and tag us @NickyMondellini.
